>>> AS PRESIDENT TRUMP ATTEMPTS TO REWRITE THE HISTORY BOOKS, HE'S TARGETING THE SMITHSONIAN, THE WORLD'S LARGEST MUSEUM COMPLEX.

AN EXECUTIVE ORDER WANTS TO ERADICATE WHAT HE CALLS A DIVISIVE RACE CENTERED IDEOLOGY.

CRITICS HIT BACK SAYING HE HAS WHITEWASHING CONFLICTS AND TROUBLED PAST.

TIRE MILES IS AN EXPERT WHO JOINS MICHELLE MARTIN TO REFLECT ON WHAT THIS COULD MEAN FOR THE FUTURE OF THE UNITED STATES.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR TALKING WITH US.

>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

I AM HAPPY TO BE HERE.

>> YOU ARE WELL KNOWN IN YOUR PROFESSION AND ALSO OUTSIDE OF IT.

A NATIONAL BOOK AWARD WINNER.

YOU ARE PROFESSOR OF HISTORY AT HARVARD.

A LOT OF YOUR WORK FOCUSES ON LIVES THAT WE HAVE NOT SEEN AS MUCH OF.

LIVES OF AFRICAN-AMERICAN PEOPLE, AFRICAN-AMERICAN GIRLS, ALSO INDIGENOUS PEOPLE.

SO YOU WRITE BOOKS, AS MOST HISTORIANS DO.

YOU ALSO HAVE WRITTEN ABOUT ARTIFACTS.

THINGS WE CAN SEE OURSELVES.

WHAT ROLE DO YOU THINK MUSEUMS PLAY IN OUR UNDERSTANDING OF HISTORY?

>> IT IS CRITICALLY IMPORTANT.

TO ME AS A RESEARCHER, MUSEUMS HAVE BEEN FOUNDATIONAL TO THE WAY I CAN ASK QUESTIONS ABOUT THE PAST, THE WAYS I CAN ANSWER ABOUT THE PAST.

LEADING TO ACCESS MATERIALS AND MUSEUMS AS WELL AS THE EXPERTS WHO CARRY THOSE MATERIALS AND STEWARD THEN AS A WAY TO RECONSTRUCT MODELS OF THINGS THAT TOOK PLACE IN PREVIOUS CENTURIES.

FOR EXAMPLE, IN ONE OF MY RECENT BOOKS IT FOCUSES ON THE CONCEPT THAT WAS PASSED DOWN THROUGH GENERATIONS.

I SAW IT IN THE SMITHSONIAN.

IT IS THAT INSTITUTION THAT ALLOWED ME AN ENTRY POINT INTO WHAT TURNED INTO A REALLY MEANINGFUL STORY BOTH FOR ME AND FOR NUMEROUS READERS.

>> SAFELY WOULD YOU TELL THE STORY?

WHAT IS ON IT.

WHAT DOES IT SAY?

WHAT IS THE STORY OF ASHLEY ZACH?

>> IT IS A BEAUTIFUL, RARE ARTIFACT.

THERE'S NOTHING LIKE IT ACROSS ANY COLLECTION THAT HAS TO DO WITH THE HISTORY AND CULTURE OF AFRICAN AMERICA.

IT IS AN AGRICULTURAL BAG OR SACK THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN USED TO CARRY BEANS OR SEEDS.

AN ENSLAVED WOMAN NAMED ROSE HAD IT IN HER POSSESSION IN THE 1850S WHEN SHE LEARNED HER DAUGHTER ASHLEY WAS GOING TO BE SOLD AWAY FROM HER.

AT THAT TIME SHE PACKED THIS PARTICULAR ZACH THAT WE STILL HAVE TODAY THAT WE CAN SEE WITH VARIOUS ITEMS SHE THOUGHT HER SMALL CHILD WOULD NEED TO SURVIVE.

ON THE SACK ITSELF, WE HAVE AN EMBROIDERED DESCRIPTION OF WHAT IT IS I AM SHARING WITH YOU NOW.

A DESCENDENT OF THAT FAMILY, A GRANDDAUGHTER AND GREAT- GRANDDAUGHTER OF THAT FAMILY SEWED THE STORY ONTO THE SACK IN SENTENCES.

IT IS AN ARTIFACT.

IT IS ALSO A TEXT.

IT CAPTURES AND REFLECTS BACK TO US THE TRIALS AFRICAN AMERICANS EXPERIENCED BUT ALSO THE PERSEVERANCE OF FAMILY TIES AND LOVE.

WHAT THAT SACK SAYS IN THE CENTER OF THE EMBROIDERY IS, THIS IS FILLED WITH MY LOVE ALWAYS.

THAT BECAME INCREDIBLY NECESSARY TO ASHLEY 'SURVIVAL BECAUSE THE SACK TELLS US SHE NEVER SAW HER MOTHER AGAIN.

>> IT IS DEVASTATING.

ONE OF THE REASONS WE ALSO CALLED YOU IS BECAUSE AS YOU KNOW, RECENTLY PRESIDENT TRUMP SIGNED AN EXECUTIVE ORDER TITLED RESTORING TRUTH AND SANITY TO AMERICAN HISTORY.

IT DIRECTS FEDERAL INSTITUTIONS LIKE THIS IS SMITHSONIAN WHICH HE SPECIFICALLY NAMES TO REMOVE WHAT HE CALLS IMPROPER IDEOLOGY AND EMPHASIZE MORE UPLIFTING PORTRAYALS OF THE AMERICAN PAST.

IT SINGLES OUT THE HISTORY OF CULTURE FOR WHAT IT SAYS IS THIS AN APPROPRIATE RACY IDEOLOGY.

THE FIRST QUESTION I HAS FOR YOU --HAVE FOR YOU IS WHEN YOU HEARD THAT WHAT WENT THROUGH YOUR MIND?

>> IT IS LIKE AN ARROW TO THE HEART TO KNOW THE PERSON WHO HAS THIS MASSIVE PLATFORM HAS DECIDED TO USE IT TO ATTACK A PRECIOUS CULTURAL TREASURE INCLUDING THE MUSEUM OF HISTORY AND CULTURE.

I FELT VERY HURT AS A BLACK WOMAN, AS A SCHOLAR AND AS AN AMERICAN.

THAT IS WHAT HAPPENED FOR ME EMOTIONALLY.

WHAT I WAS THINKING WAS, WAIT A MINUTE.

HOW CAN THIS HAPPEN?

I REMEMBER JUST A HANDFUL OF MONTHS AGO SOON AFTER THE PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION WITH MANY SCHOLARS INCLUDING THOSE THAT WORK AT THE AFRICAN-AMERICAN HISTORY AND CULTURE MUSEUM.

CURATORS WHO WERE ALSO SCHOLARS WERE TELLING THE PEOPLE AT THE CONVENING THAT THEY WERE FEELING POSITIVE.

THEY WERE FEELING CONFIDENT BECAUSE EVEN THOUGH WE HAD THE ELECTION RESULTS THAT WE DID, THEY HAD JUST TAKEN A GROUP OF CONGRESSIONAL REPRESENTATIVES THROUGH THE MUSEUM.

THEY HAD GIVEN THEM A TOUR AS IS CUSTOMARY.

THE REPRESENTATIVES WERE POSITIVE ABOUT WHAT THEY SAW DISPLAYED IN THE MUSEUM.

IT HAS ALWAYS HAD AT THE CENTER OF ITS NARRATIVE THE NOTION THAT BLACK AMERICAN STORY IS AMERICA STORY.

THERE IS NO SEPARATION.

THEY ARE DEEPLY INTERTWINED.

>> LET ME GO BACK A LITTLE BIT.

YOU SAID YOU FELT HURT.

CAN YOU SHARE MORE ABOUT THAT?

FEELS LIKE A DIRECT ATTACK.

THE LANGUAGE OF THE EXECUTIVE ORDER IS VAGUE.

WE WANT TO HEAR STORIES THAT ARE HIGHLIGHTING AMERICA'S GREATNESS.

WE WANT TO HEAR THE CORRECT IDEOLOGY.

THESE TERMS CAN MEAN ANYTHING.

I FEAR THAT THERE IS A MORE INSIDIOUS ASPECT TO THEM AND THAT A DIRECTIVE TO RESTORE OR HIGHLIGHT AMERICA'S GREATNESS ACTUALLY MEANS SOMETHING MORE LIKE A DIRECTIVE TO DIMINISH OR EXCLUDE STORIES OF LACK AMERICA.

STORIES OF MANY AMERICANS THAT ARE CHARACTERIZED BY BEAUTIFUL MOMENTS BUT QUITE A LOT OF STRUGGLE.

QUITE A LOT OF STRUGGLE THAT SOMETIMES ARE PEOPLE'S STORIES.

THE STORIES OF MANY DIFFERENT COMMUNITIES OF THE AMERICAN PEOPLE.

WE ARE GOING TO BE SIDELINED, ATTACKED, DEEMED NOT GREAT OR NOT GOOD ARE NO LONGER A PART OF THE AMERICAN NARRATIVE.

>> I AM LOOKING AT THE DIRECTIVE PICKETT SAYS OVER THE PAST DECADE AMERICANS HAVE WITNESSED A CONCERTED AND WIDESPREAD EFFORT TO REWRITE OUR NATIONS HISTORY REPLACING OBJECTIVE FACTS WITH THE DISTORTED NARRATIVE DRIVEN BY IDEOLOGY RATHER THAN TRUTH.

THIS REVISIONIST MOVEMENT SEEKS TO UNDERMINE THE REMARKABLE ACHIEVEMENTS OF THE UNITED STATES BY CASTING ITS FOUNDING PRINCIPLES AND HISTORICAL MILESTONES IN A NEGATIVE LIGHT.

OUR UNPARALLELED LEGACY OF ADVANCING LIBERTY, INDIVIDUAL RIGHTS AND HUMAN HABITS IS -- HAPPINESS IS RACIST, OPPRESSIVE OR REDEEMABLE HE FLAWED.

RATHER THAN FOSTERING A DEEPER UNDERSTANDING THE WIDESPREAD DEEPEN SOCIETAL DIVIDES AND FOSTERS A SENSE OF NATIONAL SHAME DISREGARDING THE PROGRESS AMERICA HAS MADE AND THE IDEALS THAT CONTINUE TO INSPIRE MILLIONS AROUND THE GLOBE.

THAT IS THE FIRST PARAGRAPH.

I THINK THE ARGUMENT IS THE FOCUS ON RACE IS INHERENTLY DIVISIVE AND MAKES PEOPLE FEEL BAD, SPECIFICALLY SOME PEOPLE FEEL BAD.

AND THAT DETRACTS FROM THE NATIONAL FABRIC.

IF THAT IS THE ARGUMENT WHAT WOULD YOU SAY?

>> I WANT TO PUT ASIDE THE QUESTION ABOUT RACE AND PEOPLE FEELING BAD TO GO TO THE POINT IN THE ORDER THAT YOU READ THAT HAS TO DO WITH THE REVISION OF HISTORY OR REWRITING HISTORY.

THIS ORDER TALKS ABOUT REVISIONIST HISTORY AS IF THESE ARE BAD THINGS.

ACTUALLY, HISTORY IS REVISION.

IT IS A PROCESS AT ALL THE EVIDENCE THAT WE CAN TO HELP US TO CONSTRUCT A MODEL OF THE PAST, ASKING TOUGH QUESTIONS ABOUT THE EVIDENCE, WEIGHING EVIDENCE AGAINST ITSELF AND OTHER INFORMATION WE CAN BRING IN.

ANALYZING EVIDENCE AND INTERPRETING IT, PUTTING IT FORWARD, HAVING IT BE READ AND ASSESSED AND CRITICIZED BY HER PEERS, BEING SENT BACK TO US.

WE LOOK TO CORRECT OUR MISTAKES IF POSSIBLE.

WE REFINE IT AND REVISE IT AND GO THROUGH THE PROCESS AGAIN AND AGAIN.

HISTORY DOES NOT TO STAND STILL.

IT IS NOT SOME KIND OF SOLIDIFIED, OSSIFIED THING THAT ONCE YOU'VE GOT IT IT'S JUST THERE AND THERE ARE NO CHANGES.

WE WANT HISTORY TO CHANGE PICKETT IS A PROCESS OF RESEARCH, OF INVESTIGATION, OF DIALOGUE, OF ENGAGEMENT THAT HELPS US TO MOVE CLOSER AND CLOSER TO A FULL AND CLEAR UNDERSTANDING OF THE PAST.

SO I WOULD SAY, YES LET'S EMBRACE REVISION.

REVISE THINGS TO SEE AGAIN.

WE NEED TO SEE THE PAST AGAIN.

WE NEED TO SEE OURSELVES AGAIN IF WE WANT TO SEE CLEARLY IN A FULL WAY.

>> NOW TO THE QUESTION OF FEELINGS.

THE OTHER ARGUMENT SEEMS TO BE THAT THESE NEW LEARNINGS MAKE PEOPLE FEEL BAD, ESPECIALLY CERTAIN PEOPLE AND THAT IS BAD.

THE ARGUMENT IS THAT IT RAN THAT THE SOCIAL FABRIC.

WHAT IS YOUR TAKE ON THAT?

>> I WOULD SAY THE SENTIMENTAL VALUE THAT I WOULD LIKE TO UPLIFT THAT THE SMITHSONIAN INSTITUTION ALSO HIGHLIGHTS IS THE VALUE OF KNOWLEDGE.

THE PRODUCTION AND THE SHARING OF KNOWLEDGE.

SOMETIMES KNOWLEDGE CAN PRODUCE NEGATIVE FEELINGS.

SOMETIMES WE CAN FEEL SAD WHEN WE LEARN.

THAT'S WHAT IT MEANS TO BE A HUMAN BEING WITH COMPLEX EMOTIONS.

WE CAN'T JUST SIMPLIFY THE EXISTENCE OF THINGS IN THE WORLD SO WE CAN FEEL HAPPY ABOUT THEM.

WE ARE THINKING ADULTS THAT HAVE THE RESPONSIBILITY, THE DUTY TO TRY TO SHAPE AND SUPPORT A COMPLEX SOCIETY AND A DIVERSE AND VERY COMPLICATED WORLD.

WITH REGARD TO FEELINGS, THE EXECUTIVE ORDER MENTIONS A CONCERN ABOUT PEOPLE FEELING SHAME.

I WILL SAY FIRST OF ALL, POINTING TO SHAME IS AN INTERESTING CHOICE.

THERE ARE MANY DIFFERENT EMOTIONAL RESPONSES A PERSON CAN HAVE BEEN LEARNING ABOUT THE PAST.

WHY WOULD SHAME BE THE ONE THAT THE PRESIDENT IS HIGHLIGHTING?

I HAVE PRESENTED MY WORK ON THE HISTORY OF SLAVERY AND ABOLITION IN FRONT OF MANY AUDIENCES AND OFTEN TIMES THEY FEEL A SENSE OF PRIDE.

THEY FEEL PROUD TO KNOW THAT THEY ARE INDIVIDUALS IN THE HISTORY OF THIS COMPANY -- COUNTRY THAT HAVE IDENTIFIED INJUSTICES AND FOUGHT AGAINST THEM.

SHAME DOES NOT HAVE TO BE A DEFAULT RESPONSE.

>> THE ARGUMENT IS THAT BECAUSE FEDERAL FUNDING IS PART OF THIS IT SHOULD SERVE A PATRIOTIC PURPOSE.

A SORT OF UNIFYING PURPOSE TO GIVE PEOPLE A SENSE OF PRIDE IN THE COUNTRY.

WHAT IS YOUR RESPONSE TO THAT?

>> IT IS POSSIBLE FOR MUSEUMS TO TELL STORIES THAT CAN ENCOURAGE PATRIOTISM OR A LOVE OF COUNTRY AND AT THE SAME TIME TELL STORIES THAT ARE COMPLEX.

LOVE IS NOT A SIMPLE THING.

THERE ARE PEOPLE IN MY FAMILY THAT I FEEL DEEP AND GREAT AND ABIDING LOVE FOR BUT AROUND THE THANKSGIVING TABLE WE WILL HAVE SOME DISAGREEMENTS WE NEED TO WORK OUT.

THAT IS JUST THE REALITY OF WHAT IT MEANS TO BE A HUMAN BEING AND LIVE IN SOCIETY.

I REJECT THE NOTION THAT A PATRIOTIC MUSEUM OR EXHIBITION HAS TO ONLY TELL STORIES IN A WAY THAT EMPHASIZES HEARTS AND FLOWERS AND BOXES OF BONBONS.

THAT IS NOT WHAT IT MEANS FOR A HUMAN BEING TO LIVE IN A COMMUNITY OR BE AN AMERICAN.

>> ARE YOU WORRIED?

>> I AM WORRIED.

I'M WORRIED FOR THE SMITHSONIAN, FOR OUR NATIONAL PARKS, I WORRY FOR OUR UNIVERSITIES.

PRESIDENT WHO SEEMS WILLING TO JUST CRASH THROUGH BOUNDARIES AND EXISTING PRACTICES AND EVEN THE LAW TO EXPRESS HIS DESIRES AND TRY TO ENFORCE HIS WILL.

THIS IS NOT THE COUNTRY I WAS BORN INTO.

IT'S NOT THE COUNTRY I WANT MY GRANDCHILDREN TO BE BORN INTO AND I THINK WE ALL NEED TO EXPRESS A SENSE OF CARE AND CONCERN FOR OUR CULTURAL TREASURES AND THE FUTURE DIRECTION OF OUR COUNTRY.

I WORRY THAT THE PRESIDENT FEELS LIKE THE MUSEUMS ARE HIS PERSONAL PLAYGROUNDS.

THEY ARE NOT.

THEY BELONGED TO ALL OF US.

WE HAVE TO DEFEND THEM.

>> WHAT WOULD YOU SAY TO PEOPLE TOO MANY OF THE OFFERINGS OF THESE INSTITUTIONS AND THE CURRENT MOMENT AS THEY UNDERSTAND IT CREATE FEELINGS OF DIVISION, PERHAPS FEELINGS OF SHAME AND ARE NOT SUPPORTIVE OF THE SOCIAL FABRIC OR OUR SHARED EXPERIENCE AS A COUNTRY?

>> I WOULD SAY TO ANYONE WHO FEELS LIKE THEY ARE BEING LEFT OUT OF THE AMERICAN NARRATIVE THAT I KNOW THIS IS PAINFUL.

I AM PART OF A COMMUNITY THAT HAS FELT LEFT OUT OF THE AMERICAN NARRATIVE FOR DECADES AND EVEN CENTURIES.

IT HAS ONLY BEEN IN MY LIFETIME THAT THERE HAS BEEN MORE OF A FOCUS ON BLACK HISTORY OR WOMEN'S HISTORY OR ANY OTHER PARTICULAR HISTORY OF CERTAIN GROUPS.

I WANT TO ACKNOWLEDGE THAT IT DOES NOT FEEL GOOD.

WE NEED REPRESENTATION FOR EVERYONE.

SMITHSONIAN SOME DIFFERENT KINDS OF EXPEDITIONS -- EXHIBITIONS AND NARRATIVES.

THAT IS A DIFFERENT THING THAN ONE MAN AT THE TOP OF THE COUNTRY LOOKING DOWN AND DICTATING WHAT IS TO TAKE PLACE INSIDE OF MUSEUMS IN WHICH HE REALLY DOES NOT HAVE AUTHORITY OVER.

THE SMITHSONIAN IS RUN BY A BOARD.

IT NEEDS TO ANSWER TO CONGRESS AND PEOPLE WOULD LIKE TO SEE THEIR COMMUNITY STORIES REPRESENTED DIFFERENTLY CAN CERTAINLY REACH OUT AND GIVE FEEDBACK.

THEY ARE ALWAYS LOOKING FOR FEEDBACK.

ANTICIPATE TOGETHER AS A COLLECTIVE TO MAKE THESE NARRATIVES, TO MAKE THESE STORIES MORE REPRESENTATIVE OF ALL OF THE AMERICAN PEOPLE.

>> PROFESSOR TIYA MILES, YOU FOR JOINING US.

>> THANK YOU MICHEL.